Comment and analysis on all things Charlotte

Socialized Medicine Bonus: Unauthorized Pelvic Exams

From Canada — single-payer and all, eh — comes this tale of sedated women being subjected to unapproved and unauthorized pelvic exams by whatever med students happen to be in the building at the time.

12 Responses to “Socialized Medicine Bonus: Unauthorized Pelvic Exams”

  • Jan
    30
    2010

    […] reading here: The Meck Deck » Blog Archive » Socialized Medicine Bonus … January 29th, 2010 | Tags: bonus, exams, january, Medicine, pelvic-exams, tale, unapproved-and, […]

  • Jan
    30
    2010

    So because an isolated incident happened in Canada it will also happen in the US?

    Medical malpractice happens everywhere regardless of the type of health care system involved. To use this as an example to bash the current health care proposals is incongruous and useless.

  • Jan
    30
    2010

    Looks like you missed the point:

    Guidelines in the United States and Britain say specific consent is required but, by contrast, Canadian guidelines state that pelvic examination by trainees is “implicit.”

    In other words, when the government is “paying for your healthcare” (using taxpayer money, natch), they tend to think they can do whatever they want with you as long as it “doesn’t cause any harm” (in their opinion). That unconscious person on the table is fair game for poking and prodding because we, the government, are being so gracious as to pay for the treatment they came in for.

    Let’s see how you like it if someone gives you a prostate exam while you’re unconscious on the table having minor surgery on your shoulder, Jeff.

  • Jan
    30
    2010

    Jeff…… Its called the golden rule,He who has all the gold gets to make all the rules.
    Clay is right, when someone else pays the bills they get to justify almost anything.
    Here in the U.S. insurance companies do it all the time,however if you do not like what they are doing you can change to another company.

  • Jan
    30
    2010

    You see, Jeff (other Jeff, not JAT), the biggest problem with socialized medicine is that it forces a doctor to have to compromise their Hippocratic Oath. In socialized medicine, Canada- or UK-style, when you go to the doctor with a specific ailment which he’s perfectly capable of treating and which you’re perfectly capable of paying for, there’s still a chance that he will not be allowed to treat you because he’s already performed his allowed quota of that procedure for the week/month/year — he might have all the necessary equipment and medical supplies on hand, and he might not have anyone in his waiting room right now, but he still can’t do the procedure because some bureaucrat in Ottawa or London or Washington DC has decided, in his role as the Will of the People, that only a certain number of that procedure is allowable.

    And don’t tell me this doesn’t happen — I’ve read news stories from Canadian newspapers of women in labor being forced to fly to a different province to deliver their child because the local hospital had performed their quota of childbirths for the year and legally were not allowed to do any more of them.

    I want a system where I can get any procedure I need, anytime I need it. And once I’ve had it, I will make sure the bill gets paid, either out of my own pocket or through my employer-provided health insurance — and with ZERO INVOLVEMENT from any bureaucrat and ZERO tax dollars being spent on me.

  • Jan
    31
    2010

    Clay – a reputable paper reported a verified story that a woman had to stop her labor delivery and go to another privince to deliver a child? I’m skeptical, but prove me wrong.

    Again, are these exceptions to the rule or not?

    I’m not defending socialized medicine, nor do I think the US would ever mimic anywhere near 90% of what’s happening in Canada, UK, wherever. But like Micheal Moore in his countless screeds, it’s incredibly easy to cherry pick isolated incidents of wrongdoing and pain a hugely generalized picture.

    None of you can confidently tell me that even if the current healthcare reform were to pass as is today that it would lead to this. No one knows. And I seriously doubt it would. But that’s just me.

    One reason why I think that is because so many Americans are inclined to say F the rules, I’m doing what’s right and they can punish me later.

    As for Bruce’s “golden rule” comment, in that case, we should be seeing tons of claims of doctors and insurance companies doing things they aren’t supposed to be doing….oh wait, we do see that from the insurance companies, they’ll drop policyholders to help prop up their profit margin and if they die because of it, oh well.

  • Jan
    31
    2010

    Here’s just one example, Jeff:

    http://www.komonews.com/news/10216201.html

    I’m sure there are more examples, but this sort of thing is hard to search on.

    Your argument that this is “the exception to the rule” is useless, Jeff, unless it happens more than 50% of the time. If something happens 1% of the time here in the US and 5% of the time in Canada, then there’s a problem in Canada — 5% is still a small number, but it’s five times higher than 1%.

    And your argument that we don’t know if the current legislation will lead to UK- or Canada-style problems, so therefore we should pass it anyway, is equally idiotic. I don’t expect legislation to be akin to buying lottery tickets or, even better, a game of Russian roulette. We’ve seen what socialized medicine has done in other countries. For you to claim that it will somehow be different here in the US is the textbook definition of insanity — repeating the same thing over and over and expecting a different result.

    Do we need insurance reform? Yes. Do we need tort reform? Yes. Do we need insurance portability and a system whereby insurance companies can’t reject people out of hand because of pre-existing conditions? Yes.

    Do we need the government sticking everyone (except unions, natch) with massive taxes to pay for all of this? Absolutely not.

  • Feb
    01
    2010

    National Healthcare will flourish and profit as well as the National Whitewater Center has.

  • Feb
    01
    2010

    Love being called an idiot in the morning, or reading about being called an idiot in the morning. It must be tough hanging on to friends with different opinions than you have.

    Kramer loses control of a junior mint and it goes flying into a patient’s abdomen during surgery. This has never happened in Canada, but since it happened in the US on a television show let’s stop health care reform because otherwise it’ll lead to socialized medicine….oh the horror!

    I can see that you’re not ready to listen to other people’s opinions on this subject.

  • Feb
    01
    2010

    I’d suggest you just read the UK papers where there is a horror story like this almost everyday. Their solution is of course is more Government Spending on Healthcare.

  • Feb
    01
    2010

    I’d suggest you just read the UK papers where there is a horror story like this almost everyday. Their solution is of course is more Government Spending on Healthcare.

  • Feb
    01
    2010

    First, Jeff, I did not call you an idiot. I said your argument was idiotic. There is a difference.

    Second, welcome to the Internet. You’re an anonymous person to me and not a friend of mine, so if I do happen to call you an idiot, you need to suck it up and grow thicker skin. I have friends who disagree with me on this subject, but I don’t call them idiots (at least, not to their face). You don’t merit that sort of consideration yet.

    Third, what happened on Seinfeld has no relation to reality. So why would you bring it up, except to be snarky?

    Finally, I am fully prepared to listen to other people’s opinions on the subject of healthcare reform, and I do listen to them: I’m bombarded with them daily, from the news to people such as yourself. But I have dismissed much of what I have heard as WRONG. Listening to you does not equate to agreeing with you.

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